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Bleed Needs More Love - Why Doesn't Bleed Work Before A Swap? Change This Immediately!

I just really noticed this. I’m sitting here and I bleed a Utarinex and it Rampages and Runs, fine. But my damage should have been done. I think that is very unfair that I have to sit there and watch it just swap before taking the bleed damage. That’s messed up when a counter attack still hits just fine. Change it. Now.

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It’s called Damage over time. Besides, you’re not going to get much out of bleeding a Rinex anyway.

Counter-attacks aren’t necessarily better, since they can be Distracted, Dodged and Shielded against. You can’t mitigate DoT at all.

But bleeders do need some love. Ludia really needs to integrate Vulnerability with DoT already, that would fix so many matchups.

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That’s why I liked old Spinocon. Vulnerability plus DoT was amazing.

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The only point I was making is it works before they swap and it really does matter because to this day I still get kills on dinosaurs trying to swap out and I love that. Nothing else is more fair. If a Raid Boss even still gets to hit you after it dies… I should be able to have my move count like any other before a swap out occurs. Otherwise no move should do damage before a swap and I wouldn’t agree with that at all.

See this is what breaks swap-based creatures now. If you can simply swap it out and it takes no damage and comes back in with full health, how is that fair? Now if you want to have a heal and swap, fine, but the speed would still matter on that and it could still be hit with something. Getting to do that constantly is almost like cheating. It’s like having two extra dinosaurs on the bench coming in fresh.

You’ll be less likely to bring back a dinosaur you swapped out that was hit hard. Make it fair.

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I think I speak for everyone when I say RETURN TO EXPLOIT WOUND

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That is fair, you have to use a team spot for that creature. The most dominant one, rhinex, doesn’t have much going for it because resilient meta. The “and Run” part makes these moves uses a chance to escape from the matchup alive, preventing the takedown. Most “and Run” users have usually bad HP, damage, or a combo of all 3, or rely on gimmicks like distraction.

The use of DoT is primarily to bring down tanks, or to tie a match you’d otherwise lose. This change removes DoT’s biggest weakness, which is kind of dumb. Most bleeders can swap punish with either big hits or on escape, but otherwise they have nothing.

Also, a boss isn’t dying at the end of a round, it’s simply changing tactics.

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This is why all “and Run” moves (except for cleansing swoop) have a delay.

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It’s a technical health bar depletion though. I get what you’re saying, but in any game ever when the health bar depletes usually you don’t get hit after that, even if we’re talking about Rounds. I think you’re ignoring the fact that I can kill a dinosaur before it swaps. I love Trykosaurus for that. I like consistency. All I’m asking for is consistency. If counter attacks can kill before a swap then bleeding should do some damage. This isn’t about when to use or what to use bleed for. Bleed bleeds. Simply. It should bleed some health before the swap. If the move hits it hits. Just like anything else. If any other damage hits it counts and depletes that health before the swap. A bleed should be no different? How is this even debatable? Any other damage hits before the swap if it connects before the swap occurs.

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Counter attacks and bleeds are 2 very different things. You run a bleeder for the bleed and counter attack for the counter. Comparing Tryko to something like Spinotahsuchus in terms of how it’s abilities function isn’t a good analogy because they function differently, which is good for diversity and balance.

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If bleed happens before swaps the only counter is cleanse or immunity, both of which are uncommon, shooting bleeders into a position fk power similar to 2.0 maxima. We’d have immune meta again and we all know that can’t happen

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It’s not though. It’s more than just counter attacks. That’s the problem. If I hit any move, that damage sits. It then runs. So it shouldn’t get to leave without bleeding first if I hit a bleed move.

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“And run” is the natural counter to bleeders, same as stun is the natural counter to counter-attackers. I once tried (very eloquently, I may add) that stuns shouldn’t take away two counter attacks (just one attack and one counter) basically making the same argument you’re making here and was shot down by the masses.

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That’s the cost of bleed moves, They shouldn’t be used against hit and runners.

Counter-Attacks work because they deal damage bases on the attack stat. The ones that don’t are in low speed users, so you can distract, stun, etc.

Bleed always deal damage off of max HP, and is (in most cases) at least 25% I’d the targets max HP. So being able to get rid of it is s necessary drawback. Bleed also always happens unless you can cleanse, are immune, or swap out. Bleed and counter attacks are 2 different things.

That’s the price of a bleed move, it usually guarantees a kill in 2-3 turns unless you swap

7 Likes

This isn’t about just comparing to counter attacks. If I hit that dinosaur with ANY damage before they swap it should count. It doesn’t matter if it’s a regular attack, instant charge or counter attack. I always take a chunk out of them before they swap. Bleed is the only thing that is being unfairly targeted. Why are you ignoring that? This isn’t a counter versus bleed argument.

Also as far as what you use, you use what you have against what your opponent draws. You can’t just swap because you don’t like the draw. That’s called having to adjust. Sure. You can swap, but you have to quickly determine if it’s even worth it and act accordingly.

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Thats what makes bleed diverse, every other attack has to deal based on users attack. Bleed is max HP and is damage OVER time, meaning slow but strong damage. Besides most hit and runners are cunning or function like cunnings. They’re supposed to center bleeders

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It’s really that big of a deal if it bleeds it before it swaps? But I can hit harder with another move before a swap out and nearly kill it.

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personally, that would make things like spinocon broken. i’m going to deal 33% of your HP before you swap with R&R, plus the extra damage from on escape. then possibly another rampage onto your next dino if i’m attacking. (and 33% bleed as well if hit with damage.)

that would be more broken than it should be.

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No. Bleed already needs a boost! There you go. Other things are already so overpowered like Phorusaura. But no one complains because everyone wants to use that over and over… and over and never lose any health in some cases. How can you complain about that and ignore things like this?

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Yes it is

Currently only 28 creatures have hit and run

8 are fierce/ part fierce
9 are cunning/part cunning
10 are resilient/part resilient
1 is a wild card

Of these only Phorusaura, Vexus, and Skilonemys are usable.

That’s a lot of innocents caught in the crossfire

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No, Phorus is one of the biggest targets for a nerf rn

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