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Bleed Needs More Love - Why Doesn't Bleed Work Before A Swap? Change This Immediately!

Why does this have to be changed now when it’s been this way for a long time. It does damage at the end of each turn. Dinos who run are no longer in play at the end of the turn. Don’t use bleed against dinos that have the ability to run it’s that simple.

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Rinex: excuse me sir?

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I don’t really understand the logic of this argument, no offense.

You swap out purposefully to not take that kind of extra damage. The buff you should be looking for (and the one I endorse) is that all/most bleeders should have No Escape, so that unless they are pin resistant they have to take that damage. Forcing an extra bleed turn on a smart swap out or &Run move makes zero sense.

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True but some like thyla might be too op if they add something like that

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It’s not that simple. You play what the draw is or take a hit. If it can bleed then bleed it. You’re now ignoring battle strategy. Again what’s being ignored is other greater damage still hits. If you want a move that runs with no damage call it Dash Escape.

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Those creatures aren’t the creatures bleed is meant to counter anyway. The whole point of bleed is that it isn’t direct damage, meaning you don’t have to hit your opponent to damage them (which helps against counter-attackers), that it deals damage that scales with your opponent, and that there is no way to mitigate it. This is balanced by the fact that it doesn’t all come into effect at once, otherwise it would be incredibly broken. You would have your opponent KO’d instantly in a lot of cases.

Damage over time isn’t a novel concept. Even other games like Pokemon have had it forever, and the balancing works the same way, except that status effects don’t remain after swapping something out and bringing it back in, which, even if implemented, would only help bleeders a little bit.

Uh…you don’t spend a lot of time on the forums, do you? Because it really shows. 100% of the time so far when I’ve come across a comment where someone claims that no one is talking about something to make a point, it’s been on them for not paying attention.
You can’t expect people to talk about this stuff non-stop 24x7, after all. It gets boring and pointless after a while.

There’s other, less reality-bending ways of doing it, that make more sense too. Just add Vulnerability to the higher-end bleeder moves, and have the Vulnerability multiplier increase the DoT. I’ve been saying this for ages, and I’ve proven that it balances things.

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That’s not the case with all bleeding moves. If you hit Lethal Wound which is the best move to go for you are going to get hit by a counter attack. I get hit all the time. I wish all bleed moves were non-damage moves that just bled, it would be nice, but then again I would miss taking a gash out along with the bleed. But again, this is being ignored. The damage done from Lethal Wound would still occur no matter what and it would run, so the bleeding should still take place as well. Can we stop comparing this solely to cunning when ALL other damage hits before they run?

This is a personal isolation on bleed specifically and that’s what makes it unfair. If it were other moves too then it would be less of an issue. I also take issue with the fact that Stun is so powerful that it stuns Swap Prevention. I hate that. If something stuns my Stygidaryx it should still have its Swap Prevention matter and count.

Why should that dinosaur get to stun, I lose an entire turn and then they can just simply swap while I remain locked down? That’s messed up. They took a whole two turns away from me, the least I can get is my ability to be automatic as it should be. It’s a passive ability. Passive abilities should always work no matter what.

A lot is really wrong with bleeders and they are long overdue to be on top of the mountain or at least close. Even if that means adding a Second Wind or Cadaveric Spasm ability so that passive abilities always activate.

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Yeah once. You’ll keep dealing damage even if you don’t hit your opponent for the next 2 turns, which you would have to do in any other situation. All DoT moves work this way, there’s no exceptions.

That’s because bleed does things nothing else does, so it needs to be balanced in a way nothing else is. I disagree that it’s unfair.

Yeah, that would make counter-attackers overpowered. Also, disagree.

But that’s just over-the-top and unnecessary. There’s much, much simpler ways of going about it that work better than what you’re describing. You don’t need to use a shotgun to kill a mosquito.

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No we aren’t talking about attacks just abilities. Swap Prevention is not an attack of any type whereas counter attack literally has it in the name. You people are obsessed with counter attacks. I don’t understand why.

Also I get how damage works. I was saying it hurts still on Lethal Wound that it still hits you from the damage it does. I was just stating that the biggest bleed move hits and doesn’t give you the luxury of playing it without hitting so there is no counter damage inflicted.

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Counter-attacks are Passive abilities. You don’t get to decide what is and isn’t a Passive.

It still bypasses counter-attacks, which was my point. It doesn’t bypass all of them, but it certainly makes a big difference from a non DoT move.

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But an attack is still an attack. I can’t label something passive when the dinosaur actively does something. Movement is involved. It’s illogical. I completely understand where you’re coming from, but look at a game that has you hit a key for each move, let’s say 1-8. You have those buttons to trigger active abilities and attacks. You also have passive abilities and attacks that aren’t triggered they just simply happen naturally. But the difference is this is an attack because it’s a counter attack. An ability is something like Heals 0.5 of health for 12 seconds while out of combat. I mean like that. Strictly an ability versus an attack that isn’t actively activated.

Actually… it makes far more sense for a stun to stop a counter-attack because a physical act is taking place, but you do not need a physical act to swap prevent. That’s just like a perk in Call of Duty. You are either shooting a gun, or you’re using a perk.

If there were something in Call of Duty that could stop me from shooting my gun I could still use a Killstreak to attack. In Planetside 2 if your weapons lock you can still use a turret.

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Yeah, swap-prevention is something the Dino actively does too. It’s the player that is passive, in both cases.

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I get it. I really do get it, but the difference is if you stun a creature it makes sense that it can’t counter regardless. How can you not see that swap prevention is different? Nothing happens other than locking it down. The creature shouldn’t have to be awake for that to occur. A swap prevention is a swap prevention no matter what. It would be the same if a healer had a passive heal. If it’s stunned why shouldn’t it still heal 0.75 percent of damage each hit? Even if stunned? That’s the whole point.

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Why not? It’s common sense. No Escape is a direct parallel to crocodilians being able to grab their prey in their jaws and not let go. How on earth is a creature supposed to stop another from escaping while being stunned (you don’t even need to play the game to know that that’s a rhetorical question).

You’re asserting that what you’re saying makes sense, without any reasoning other than the fact that you believe it. Just because you think that way doesn’t mean it makes sense.

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That’s not to say there aren’t other ways of stopping your opponent from escaping. You can just pursue them. No Escape did have its origin among the crocs though.

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I again understand what you mean, but the way gaming has worked forever is some things happen naturally (passively) without needing to be triggered and they happen anyway. The difference with counter attack is it requires a literal physical movement for attack. A passive heal or swap prevention doesn’t. Sure they code in animation, for fluidity, but that’s it.

Passive abilities in Massive Multiplayer Online Role Playing Games are that way and always have been. I just don’t get why this is ignored here. Again I go to shooter games. I have a thing on a Galaxy in planetside where I can heal it actively. It’s an aircraft or install something that will auto heal. Now you also can do this with a MAX suit which makes you a vehicle technically for that moment, but if the enemy throws an EMP grenade it stops equipment from healing things, if they drop a stun style grenade it stops you. Shooting becomes impossible like stunning in Arena, but your passive heal doesn’t stop.

If you want the way this Swap Prevention works changed to make you feel better then we could call it quicksand and have it there at the beginning of the introduction of the creature with the ability. Then you could hand quicksand at their feet.

But this is not how this is suppose to work. They messed it up.

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No it’s working as intended no escape has a counter.

Also JWA functions closest to Pokémon, and even that’s a stretch. It’s dinosaurs, not D&D.

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Another baseless assertion. No Escape is an On Escape ability, some of which deal damage. There’s no line between the damaging and non-damaging ones the same way non-damaging moves are still moves that the creature makes. You could argue that a creature using Instant Distraction or Immobilize (which is pretty close to No Escape) isn’t actively doing anything either.

And again, a passive ability by this game’s definition is an ability that triggers without player intervention. It doesn’t necessarily suggest that the creature isn’t actively doing anything.

Are you saying that it keeps healing when both grenades are used on you together?

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Yes! It keeps healing and it should because the amount of damage being done to me doesn’t matter nor does the fact that it may stop me from physically doing damage. Passively this heal mechanic works regardless and that is how it is suppose to be.

This is what I’m use to. I also did think about Instant Distraction, but didn’t bring it up because I thought it would muddy the waters due to how irrelevant it is in this specific scenario. Everyone needs to remember this is a very specific situation we are looking at here. So, yes I see your point, but the ultimate difference is this… Instant Distraction is triggered. It’s not something like Swap Prevention. Now if it were a functionality that had a description like this:

“Instant Distraction: Whenever your opponent swaps in a new creature, automatically prevent damage by 100%”

then you would have a comparison to be made and I would agree. That’s an example of how this is different. Instant Distraction is one way, Swap Prevention is another.

In games there are things that occur regardless of any other occurrences. Swap Prevention is one of those types of functions. It’s a control. In a world of unpredictability it’s a control.

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You’re missing the point. I said that you can’t differentiate between a non-damaging passive from a damaging passive any more than you can a non-damaging move from a damaging one. On Escape Abilities are clearly actions that the creature takes, especially since some of them involve dealing damage. No Escape is an On Escape ability.

The idea that No Escape is something environmental like quicksand both doesn’t make sense and is unnecessarily complex.

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