Ludia Forums

Does anyone think the current trophies system is fair?

I will try to make this as short as possible (but I know I will fail). My team consists of one level 23, five 24s and two 25s, 6 Tyrants and 2 High Apex, and I have aplied a total of 7 boosts (2 dinos with 1/1/1 and 1 speed on Procerat). I’ve been around 4900-5100 trophies (highest at 5144 or so).

  1. How is it that I face much stronger teams of heavily boosted level 27-29 dinos, commonly Thors that are faster than anything I have and can pretty much one-shot almost anything except my Maxime (which usually don’t get selected when I face those, and can also sometimes be one-shoted by the 2x attack of such Thors). They also have a higher trophy count. Then I lose miserably, and then I lose 36-38 trophies!!! And when I beat someone, even if they still have better dinos than me, I only get 20-22 trophies. I just lost 4 in a row and dropped 153 trophies. I will have to win about 7 in a row to return to where I was.

I know they may have CURRENTLY less trophies than me. But still, then am I just being HEAVILY PUNISHED because I am skilled and have more trophies than I “should”, and are they being HEAVILY REWARDED for being much lower on trophies than they “should” be? So Ludia, do you think someone who has strong dinos but isn’t good enough to go higher in trophies, deserves to win much more trophies for beating someone with weaker dinos who is more skilled and thus have a similar trophy count? How is that fair?

It’s like a very rich football (soccer - or any other sport you like) team faces a smaller one, but they happen to be doing similarly on the points table. Let’s say Man City faces Watford and they’re both at about 50 points after 30 matches (which would be awesome for Watford and awful for City). And then the league goes like: if City wins, they get 5 points instead of 3. If Watford wins, they get just 1 point. That’s just because City has better (or more expensive) players. Does anyone think this sound fair?

  1. How is anyone supposed to have fun playing a game like this, getting matched against someone who has a dino that is faster and can one-shot all of your own dinos, and having to just sit there and watch their team get smashed? (At least give us a QUIT button!)

Ludia, do you still really think boosts are such a great idea? Is it working for you, are you getting lots of money? I mean, I know a company needs money. But this isn’t working for US, except maybe for a handful of players who are willing to spend many hundreds of dollars. Most of us are still playing because they love dinos, but are having less and less fun. You should think about the future. You’ve already managed to completely ruin JW:TG (does anyone still play that? Are the servers still running?). So, unless you have some great idea for a new game, you should really think about where you’re going with JWA. I really don’t want to quit, but each time I lose 4 battles in a row to much stronger teams and lose 150 trophies, it makes me wonder…

I really would like to hear from people who think this trophies system is fair. I think it should consider only the strength of the teams (including boosts) and not the current trophy count. And the boosts system really needs to change again, or even better, be gone for good.

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You are not being rewarded or punished with trophies. They are a ranking system, and the reason you fluctuate within a range. If you win, you move up and face tougher opponents. Hit the maximum of your range and your more likely to face stronger teams than yours. Lose a bunch of games, drop down and face teams at the bottom of your range that are more likely to be weaker than yours. The cycle then continues.

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Only problem is with team strength matchmaking, improving your team doesn’t actually improve you team…see it only improves you opponents that are selected to match you.

Also I believe the rating only acts as a carrot on a stick to keep players spending in one direction, though not actually moving.

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How would you be facing improved opponents if your team is not improving? Are your opponents in the 5500s? I haven’t encountered anyone above 5150 (being mostly within and slightly below your range).

With team strength based matchmaking, the opponent the system selects you to fight is based on how strong your team is, when your team gets stronger, it selects a stronger opponent so its “fairer” (least thats the guise it uses), so when you boost your team, your dinosaurs get stronger, but in turn you are put against a stronger opponent, so your power level relative to your opponent is unchanged.

However 100% trophy based MM (for the arenas that have it, the majority don’t) its fairer because a stronger team means you are now stronger than the next personal in line.

This isn’t the case with team strength MM algorithm.

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Saxist01 I think you didn’t get the main point. Of course if I keep winning, I will face stronger teams. The point is, why should I get 20 trophies if I win and lose 40 if I lose? Even if my opponent is stronger than my own team? It should be either 30 points win/lose everytime, of the weaker team should get more trophies when it wins. I don’t see why someone should get MORE points for winning just because their team is STRONGER.

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Yeah, that sounds like the basic cycle. Improve your team through either leveling up, or boosting. Then face more difficult opponents.

My point is, it doesn’t matter how many trophies you are winning or losing. You’re still in that 4900-5100 range. You aren’t being punished or rewarded.

It’s like Stiffeno said. You should face stronger teams BECAUSE you won battles and went up the ranking (trophy based MM). You shouldn’t be punished just because your team got stronger, even if you didn’t win any battle yet.

But that was still not the main point (I know, my text was too long for people to read it all). I just don’t see why I should lose more points when I lose a battle, than I win when I win. I lose 3 battles, then win 5 and end up lower in trophies than I started.

So how am I supposed to break my range and go above that 4900-5100? You’re saying it’s impossible, no matter how smartly I play? So there’s simply no point in trying? That doesn’t make a lot of sense.

I don’t understand what you’re seeing as a punishment. I’m assuming you’ve kept that 200 point range consistently. That is the only function of trophies, to keep you in a competitive range of MM. how many trophies you gain or lose in any given match makes no difference, and you would probably have more fun if you didn’t focus on it and instead focused on that range.

No, I’m not saying it’s impossible. By either leveling up your Dinos or applying boosts, a higher trophy count is inevitable. Because, eventually, you become that person with a lvl 30 Thor.

Have you considered the possibility that the game WANTS to keep a player in the exactly same place/range, frustrated and spending a fortune the whole time trying to break free?

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No, because I’ve seen a correlation between leveling up/boosting and increased ranking with regards to my team.

And im assuming you don’t spend a cent on those boosts right? because spending to get anywhere is exactly the problem I suggested.

No, haven’t spent any money on this game. Been playing consistently since Valentine’s Day. But even people who buy boosts aren’t a problem. Their team strength will be reflected in their trophy count. That’s what it is there for.

Saxist01, it’s a punishment because I need to win more times than I lose, to end up in the same place. I think it would be normal that, if I won more than I lose, I would climb the ranks and end up above those 5100.

I’m supposed to face teams of about the same strength, right? I don’t see a problem if I beat a team that is WEAKER than me, and then I win less than the regular 30 trophies, or that, if I lose to the same weaker team, I win less than 30. That would reflect the players skill. If I’m skilled enough to beat a stronger team, I get (rewarded) more points. If I’m not skilled, and lose to a weaker one, I lose (punished) more points.

But if I lose to a team that is STRONGER and lose MORE points, and the next battle I beat that very same team and get LESS points, that’s punishment. For being more skilled.

After all, even if I’m skilled enough to beat stronger teams and get ahead of them in the rankings, the game ends up pushing me back down, because if I beat 2 stronger teams and lose to 1 I end up back where I was before. Even if I have over 50% win rate over stronger teams. That is what doesn’t make sense to me.

That’s why what you’re saying means, no matter how skilled I am, I am supposed to stay in the same range and not go up. Só battles are useless. I might as well just enter, sit there and wait for whatever happens, and i would still end up in the same range.

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In the end, if I got to a point where I had all the tyrant dinos to level 30 and maximum boosts, I would be on top of the ranking. No matter how lousy I play. Because the only thing that matters is team strenght and not your battle skill.

You don’t need to see any of this as punishment. You lose 4 in a row, drop 150 points and catch a winning streak on the way back up. It sounds like the trophy system is working well, keeping you in a range that is compatible with your skill and team strength.

Team strength is a big factor, but not the only one. I’ve only experienced an overall upward trend in my ranking as I leveled up dinosaurs, but I remember seeing a rapid increase in my ranking after realizing swap in moves didn’t just swap into a random dinosaur.

Are you currently above 5000 trophies? if so you get from what the devs say 100% trophy based MM, which isn’t an issue.

Those below 5000 are subjected to the team strength rubbish that makes you opponents stronger based on YOUR team strength.

Take this for example with the team strength MM:

Your team (as an example)
100% strength

Opponent
110% strength

Ok now lets say you boost your team or level up to 110% (just using numbers here to give ya an idea)

The matchmaking will now change that 110% strength opponent you WOULD have faced, and instead chuck a stronger one at you.

See how each time you make your team stronger, the MM see’s that your team strength “score” has increased due to levelling up a dinosaur or boosting it, and then chooses another, stronger opponent rather than that “110%” one.

So no matter how much you level or boost, if you are subjected to the strength MM, it will continue to increase the difficulty of your opponents even if you haven’t had a single battle, which means not only is spending or levelling the team doing nothing against the relative strength of the chosen opponent, but its actually counterproductive.

The stronger the MM thinks your team is, the stronger it will make your selected opponent.

Now lets say inctead of levelling up a dinosaur, you take one of your high levels off your team and replace it with a much much lower level (say you remove a level 29 and put a 20 in its place), the MM will now see your team is “weaker” and give you a weaker opponent…see how this system not only doesn’t make sense, but it actually makes arena dropping and team manipulation beneficial.