Ludia Forums

How to fix PVP

Ok, first, the problem: PVP isn’t fun anymore. Hasn’t been fun since update 2.4.18. Why not? Because the matchups aren’t winnable anymore, and the trophy win/loss algorithm is stacked against the player now. The result? Most players cannot advance in trophy count. News flash: when players can’t advance, it isn’t fun anymore.

How to fix it: this isn’t rocket science, just put it back the way it was before 2.4.18.

Keep the new league ranks, keep the monthly reset, keep the monthly rewards for leagues attained. Just put the matchups, bots, and scoring back the way it was.

Was it perfect back then? No. People had gripes. But at least it was playable. We could advance our trophy count if we worked at it.

Please put it back the way it was. I want to feel like PVP is playable again.

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I agree that at least on my level it isn’t quite as fun as it was before and I’d like to see some evenness and consistency in the match making. I also wouldn’t mind it going back. However, like I have said before in other posts, usually it is unhappy people making comments and not the ones who are happy with it. I have personally dropped 300ish spots in the last week and a half or so. For that to happen would mean that at least 300 people have advanced.

True, but the beauty of the previous system was that you could play against bots and actually have a reasonable chance of winning 3 or so in a row before losing due to being setup to fail against a group of level 20s.

No players lost any trophies because it was against bots. And if I win 3 25 point matches and then lose a 25 point match, I have a net gain of 50. I can advance if I work at it.

In the current system, this cannot be done. Because the bots start at unwinnable levels and only get easier after losing a few times. So the end result is a net loss of trophies, not a net gain.

I’m not disagreeing that the old way was better. It definitely was for me. I hate to speak for others intentions but I think what the devs might be trying to do, misguidedly in my mind, is to get people ranked by actual skill and power and not just by the sheer number of games played. With the bots being easier people who play more have an advantage as far as raising their trophies. Personally I think this is fair because if you are more active you should be able to gain. All I was saying is that obviously not everyone is dropping because for me to go down a spot means someone has to go up. Maybe total trophy count is going down because maybe if I am losing 50 someone else is just losing 40 so they gain 10 on me.

I personally like the old way, my only point was that it would be impossible for nobody to be advancing in position if others are dropping

I also wish we could go back to the previous matchmaking mechanics. Unfortunately I cannot foresee any signifcant changes to PvP. The latest update illustrated a switch in philosophy by the development team. To increase revenues the developers have chosen to switch from the ‘carrot’ model to the ‘stick’.

The Carrot
Prior to the recent update WoW progression was relatively simple and affordable. Other than surmounting a few minor paywalls the game was fun and cheap. Enjoyment and Gratification were the carrots. Modelling has indicated this method has been a highly successful motivator when used correctly for mobile apps.

The Stick
The stick paradigm replaced the carrot model with update 12. Challenges have become increasing difficult and PvP has been onerous. This model anticipates players will allocate funds to improve their chances at success in both PvP and challenge mode. This model accepts fewer players will fully enjoy the game, but relies on the top players increasing their financial outlay to retain a competitive balance amongst their peers.

The carrot method requires a larger number of players to spend fewing dollars, while the stick method needs few players spending more.

Unfortunately, until the developers decide return to the previous paradigm, players in the lower leagues will need to endure the flagellation inherent to the stick model.

Just cancelled VIP. I cant pay for this misery. I am lucky to win 1-5 against these super bots, and my ranking just steadily goes down, and daily quests are now way too time consuming. I don’t think I have even seen an update this bad in any game I have ever played, and I play Neverwinter!

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Everyone has their opinions and views on the p2p. For myself personally, I hate pvp in general. They will never generate revenue from me using pvp as a motivating factor. They chose to add rewards and farmable chests to it. Therefor they have an obligation to make it playable for all. Otherwise players could just forget about it. So that the only ones playing it are those that pvp is what they like to do.

I am not normally a pvp guy either. My goal is to be where I get the most equipment for my guys. Before the leagues I didn’t care about my trophy count as long as it was over 2200 because that was where you got the max amount of gear. I play games like these because I enjoy the graphics or the gameplay. I don’t feel the need to be at the top of the pvp ladder. That is unless it gets me better gear. Since it does not do that I don’t really care. My recent concerns with trying to be helpful is because of where I am at it will take me time to get to the highest league and that extra chest so I am trying to give feedback to help that experience be more enjoyable for everyone.

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Maybe those people that have taken those spots have just moved up as part of a random process.

Overall I’ve gone down a lot but I’ve had runs of going up 300 within those times.

Discovering the issues with the update were intentional and learning the developers are pleased with the current state has completely undermined my appreciation for WoW. I have decided to join with those who have cancelled VIP. This has been a measured decision. Since the update I no longer enjoy the challenges or PvP and the adjustments are providing less chests and fewer rewards. Now I am often unable to acquire the 3rd die in challenges and the introduction of the new PvP algorithm has made these matches unpleasant. Trophy count rankings have become engineered rather than natural. Perhaps I will find some enjoyment competing as a free player.

I too am and have been very frustrated with PVP.

  1. Lack of options. I am so tired/bored of pushing/being pushed back - advancing a tank - and burning.
  2. Constantly being one shot - one shot killing my entire team. This happened in two of my last three games. Once by Barbarian and once by Warlock! I know that is gear, but why am I going up against a team like that?
  3. Counter Attack. Why the heck do I counter attack my own team?
  4. Dominate - two full turns??? Guaranteed loss if my rogue or mage for me. No way to stop it.
  5. Me with three legendaries going up against teams with full legendary gear or super high level commons. Rankings/pvp match ups need to be totally redone imho.
  6. Once someone "grows’ out of a rank do NOT allow them to go back and have easy wins!!
  7. And the worst - I have this too. Advance tank with Counter attack - FOUR full turns. Potential to CA 16 times. Yes…SIXTEEN. This is broken in PVP big time imho. Yes, I know ranged can handle, but if no range???
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Orloch you say they are “pleased with the current state” like it is something they said themselves. Did I miss something or are you just making assumption based on what has happened?

Turbo I did say that is possible people have moved up by losing less than others have. My only point was that it would be impossible for no one to be advancing up the rankings if others have dropped in rankings

Lee maker… regarding number 6. For someone “to go back and get easy wins” that would mean they would have to lose first. If they lose some to go back and win some that ends up coming out equal. And since all we get are trophy points there is no real gain in that strategy.

Another thing I just thought of. I was able to see from 490-788 in the rankings. I wasn’t able to see trophy totals as far down as 2500, but I was able to see those at 2750, which there were 4 players there. That’s means everyone who reset to 2750, which I am one of has played at least one game since the reset.

Anyone who doesn’t have an exact score of 2500 2750 3000 3250 or 3500 has played at least once since the reset. They may have become idle since but in the last however long it has been they have played at least once. And not everyone is as addicted as we all are. Most probably just play a couple of times a day or every few days and don’t come into the forums at all. I have played mobile games since the first iPhone and this is the first forum I have cared to be a part of

I really wasn’t trying to argue and I didn’t mean to insinuate you needed an accurate count. You were just stating a couple of things like the devs being happy with the way things are like it was an established fact. I honestly believed I could have missed something.

And as far as placement standings I was just using what I could see based on where I am. My point was that we could all look around our current standings to see how many, if any, were still at the reset numbers, that would tell us how many haven’t played since the reset.

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If devs said that on fb, twitter or wherever else they communicate. That this isn’t going to change for a couple months. I might lose my mind before then and do something smart like delete app.


  1. an opinion or conclusion formed on the basis of incomplete information.

You are the one who is stating opinions based on what you see in game and read in the forums

If the devs have stated that “the majority” of people losing trophies and having unwinnable battle was there intentions and that it won’t change u til at least mid winter. I have not seen it nor have I seen anyone else say they have. It is easy to claim something as a fact if you can’t back it up

I can believe that they said that they mechanics of the game as they are now are how they intended them to be. I do not believe that they said “ yeah we planned for the majority of people to lose more often”

That is the conjecture part

Anyways I am done with this argument.

Orloch most of the time we seem to, if not agree, at least are able to have a decent conversation and this one has devolved into something I did not mean it to be. I wish you the best of luck and if you are in the U.S. I hope you had a great thanksgiving