Ludia Forums

In defense of a boost reset

Before starting I’d like to plug OrigamiRobot’s opinion piece on the matter. It’s well done and deserves a read. I’ll reference it once or twice as well.

This has been a much talked about topic, and because of that I’d ask the mods not to lock this thread and perhaps allow it to be the home of the discussion.

After reading the 2.1 release notes I noticed a lot of great changes. Quality of life improvements to raids, the new apex creature, and more organization tools are all exciting. However, after reading some of the changes to some key creatures, there was an essential item that was missing in the notes, and that’s a boost reset.

You can assume correctly I’m referring to Maxima. Due to poor play testing and Ludia’s own doing, Maxima was undoubtably broken in 2.0, as was Tryko. In order to keep the game fair and balanced, these creatures needed to be adjusted. Unfortunately, one creature was made an example, while the other was treated fairly.

Tryko’s decel counter was taken away, and on paper this seems to be enough to make him more balanced. He’s still a formidable creature, but now must rely on his resilient impact to slow anyone down.

Max on the other hand was beaten within an inch of its life, and while begging for mercy Ludia lit it on fire. Its distraction resilience going from 75% to 0% and losing its armor may have been enough. Kicking a creature while its down, or dousing it in gasoline, Ludia lowered its HP and ATK and then lit the match by making taunt shattering rampage a 2 turn cooldown. Maxima needed a nerf but got an execution.

In light of this massacre we just witnessed, some form of boost reset is a must. Designing a creature to be objectively oppressive so players are forced to invest their boosts into it to be competitive, then turning around and nerfing it into the ground without a boost reset is unethical, and borderline theft. A fully boosted creature has $400 worth of boosts tied into it. Expecting players to throw away $200 of that investment to “refund” half of them back is disgusting and beyond greedy. At the end of the day, I can shrug off Max being nerfed into oblivion. What I can’t shrug off is having my $400 worth of boosts go down with it.

Not allowing us to reset our boosts on Max is the equivalent of buying a fully loaded Audi, and Audi then coming to us saying “We made a mistake designing your car, we need to take out some key features to make it more safe”, them then stripping it down while not offering any sort of refund/compensation. We’d never let Audi get away with it, but yet we allow Ludia to get away with it almost every update.

I’ve seen the argument thrown around “Max was so powerful; you should’ve known it would have been nerfed.” Going along with what OrigamiRobot said in his opinion piece, that argument is correct. It’s also unrealistic and defeats the point of the game. Paraphrasing OR, losing a lot now to maybe have it pay off later is horrible gameplay. If that’s the game Ludia wants us to play we should all reconsider our role in it. I can concede a game wide boost reset may be overkill, but allowing us to reset the affected creatures at zero or very little cost to ourselves is a perfectly reasonable request/expectation.

A boost reset is needed but is just a band aid at this point. Looking at the 2.1 release notes, our “Max” problem is going to happen all over again with Geminititan. Players will demand a nerf on gemititan (again) and if it gets the same treatment Max did, we’ll need another boost reset. It really makes you wonder if Ludia wants their game to be fun, fair, and balanced, or they just want to play the bait and switch game with OP creatures.

At the end of the day, boosts aren’t the problem, their implementation is. Plugging OrigamiRobot one last time, his idea of fixing the boost system sounds pretty great, so go give that a read. It would allow slightly more boost experimentation, give Ludia a source of revenue, and updates would be far more forgiving.

As for right now, 2.1 needs a boost reset on Max and we as a community need to hold Ludia accountable and expect nothing less.

60 Likes

The easiest solution is just refunding our boosts by the end of each season, and after every patch. Allows people to experiment with their boosts, even if they create monsters, they’re probably gone by the end of the month.

13 Likes

I’d love that. I just don’t think Ludia would ever be that generous. They do need a continual source of revenue, and if they give us that many resets, once we have enough boosts to fully upgrade 8 creatures we don’t need to pay anymore. There needs to be a fair middle ground though because the current implementation has started a self destruct on the game

9 Likes

The whole you shouldn’t boost a dino that’s so op you know will get nerfed argument is such a bad argument.

A) Their shouldn’t even be two op Dino’s every single patch that scream invest in me. Period… I was willing to give Ludia the benefit of the doubt they are just bad at balance for like a year. But after two years their not bad… their actually pretty good Looking at their track record they’ve only made one thing they considered a mistake and that was launch smilonem… he warranted hotfixed after like a week. And looking back at all the events that transpired after it (Ludia plans months ahead on that stuff) blue incubators, raptor scents, blue everywhere. It was cause he was stealing indo g2 thunder and they were giving us carbo the follow month.

B) when a Dino is nerfed it should be like Tryko was … that’s a fair nerf… you don’t hear people asking for their Tryko boosts back. You here people asking mainly for their max boosts back sometimes counter they built because of max.

A common argument I also hear is if we do boosts refunds people will just keep boosting the next op creature with no consequences. Well if Ludia has do a refund every time they nerf stuff to the ground maybe they’ll stop with this bait and switch…

Instead people wanna see other players punished cause Ludia can’t or won’t provide a balanced game which is about as absurd logic as I’ve seen on a game forum.

17 Likes

Actually the best way to rebalance a dino is to change its stats and leave its inherent abilities alone. That way, those that have invested their boosts heavily on a creature will have the option of rolling back & redistributing the boosts as they see fit on the same creature instead of losing all of it if no boost reset is imminent.

4 Likes

The audi analogy is pretty much spot on. Customer buying an item going home happy knowing what they bought, only to get ripped off afterwards without having any saying in the matter.

With no boost reset, several, if not many top players are done with this game. That will certainly hurt Ludia’s wallet too. There’s still time to make this right.

11 Likes

Additionally, when 2.0 was initially released, Ludia’s solemn advice was to “have a feel of the dinos’ new abilities for a couple of weeks” before one applies any boosts into it.

Fair enough. Just don’t change its abilities later without any boost reset cos it cost us 30 boosts per creature should you decide to nerf it to death.

2 Likes

Lots of players put all of their boosts into Maxima and terrorized the arena for 2 months. Now, you want a boost reset for them? No, thanks.

4 Likes

With or without a boost reset you’ll be just as terrorized by max boosted gems after 2.1. The problem isn’t the players playing the game the way it’s designed. The problem is with the game designed or in this cause the games balance.

14 Likes

I just have to write down my opinion here again like I did a lot of times in the past and yet we are still having the same problem over and over again:

  • RESET BOOST COMPLETELY TO 0 WITH EVERY NEW PATCH UPDATE WITHOUT REFUNDATION

People will be furious at first point that they lose all of their investment in this game including me, but there is no other way your updates makes any sense. Your new creatures (even if they are good) wont be used because of previous boost barrier and believe me or not … people will have to use bad but boosted creature, because that boost you didnt reset will make that creature still better sadly. I would rather take one huge wave of criticism but actually solve the problem like acting slowly and solve nothing.

5 Likes

Thanks the Fett for making this post, and is 100% spot on as is @OrigamiRobots article which I highly recommend everyone here reads. If you can read that article and still have that I told you so attitude blah blah blah then there’s really no reason talking to you. There should be a reset each new update. This allows players to use dinos and the. Change that team allowing the meta to change and adapt regularly. Boosts are expensive, sure top players will reset during season to gain edge but for everyone else that’s months worth of work or 100s of dollars gone. Everything afterwards can be half reset, otherwise let people use boosts. If I want nitro Thor for a patch fine, then I level up morty I should be able to switch otherwise you get stuck with same team for months on months. Players still need to hunt and level to get dinos to team level, stop making boosts a chore.

7 Likes

Precisely. Think of it like a competition. You want to win, so naturally you would invest in the best performing asset. But if the company who created the asset and just made its performance worst than ever, people are going to complain. No one irl will say ‘that’s your fault for investing in such an asset’. Same here in JWA. If you want to win, get a beefy max. You can run its counter, but the counters can get easily shut down by many other dominant creatures like Thyla vs Magna. So the best way is to see who has the biggest Max, similar to real life

It’s not a case of them not being generous. They do give occasional resets after all. But here you have hit the nail on the head. If after every update all boosts were reset, no one would buy any boosts after they had enough to max out the best eight creatures. Whether we like boosts or not, that’s just not going to generate income.

I do agree though that a suitable middle ground is needed.

1 Like

I guess Ludia dont have very good management section or dont have it at all. First of all u wanna have people using your app and as many as you could. This should be your company´s know-how.

More people mean more money, doesnt really matter if they are free to play. A lot of people will only bring more and more people in the game, especially if they are happy and if they can refer great rating of the game. Same happen to me when my dad introduced me this game, if he wont refer me this game is good I would never try to play it and after all you actually earn some money from me, that´s the goal.

You simply can not rely on to just fool people by baiting them to use their boost and then make their boost investment completely useless and after all hope these people will go on and buy boosts again? They wont, or especially majority of them. Now the part I would worry about the most, they will refer this game is not great and rating will decrease and instead of bringing new people in, people will leave. Boosts sales shouldnt be your only income way … there are other good stuffs like sanctuary items or incubator sales.

Hopefully, there wont be similar baits like there are with boosts in the near future. I wish you all the best listening to your community and make them happy so we can rise, right now I am afraid this game soon or later going to die.

3 Likes

Ludia can just add more new good(but balanced) hybrids without exclusive ingredients which could tempt people to experiment with different teams and boost them,thus requiring most players to buy more boosts. People that had their boosted creatures nerfed to the ground don’t get (in this case at least,rightfully) upset,ludia can still make big bucks,we get cool new creatures,the people who like hunting have stuff to hunt,etc. Maybe add more wacky but not impossible requirements for tourneys(like an all cunning or only permian) and make epic 24h inc trials a tiny bit harder to get people interested in stuff they’d normally not use. A little balancing tweaks here and BAM

And if they ‘accidentally’ end up making a BOOST ME hybrid they can hopefully balance em without destroying them

I was gonna write a proposal here, realized it was a book and didn’t wanna hijack the thread.

But this is an idea I had the other night as an alternative to Ludias current balancing.

1 Like

100% spot-on. It’s time for Ludia to deceide between decency and fraud.

4 Likes

On a scale from 0 to 10, how likely is Ludia going to take our good suggestions seriously?

This is the way to put a debate up for discussion.
Well said @TheFett

Ludia have admitted they messed up with Maxi, the harsh nerf proves it. So the least they can do is put their hands up and return our boosts.

This would be a gesture that will keep the players happy and with new creatures including an apex, players will still buy more boosts.

If boosts aren’t returned I can honestly see a lot of players uninstalling the game. So who wins then?

5 Likes

Until now, I have been buying boost.

Give us refund, and I’ll buy more for new creatures, tourneys and raids.

No reset, no more buy for me.

And, Ludia, do you understand that there are other ways of generating cashflow?

11 Likes