Ludia Forums

Pvp is crap!

How much life is left in this game? I noticed no new messages the last 3 days?!

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Many long-term players are unsubscribing PvP.
I meet real players in PvP only if I wait for 15 mins at least and are always the same 2/3 players.

This is the result of Ludia’s poor management of not listening to players/maximize their profit.

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As usual, I agree 100% with @Fizbanius astute assessment.

I offer a drastic solution which might interest many former players, which seems necessary to rescue the app. Before I elaborate, it is essential to realize WoW once had a multitude of players. Precisely two years ago, one single thread in the forums had over 70,000 views. Now most threads have less than 500. This confirms the extinction of the user base.

Perhaps returning the game to a previous state may save the app. This would need to be be an iteration prior the quest levy, before the long standing server connectivity issues, earlier than the many despised hero/items adjustments, antecedent of the treacherous Guild Raid or Rallys (whichever one is has been endless crawl), previous to the notorious event algorithm, before seasons were introduced, and most importantly, before the introduction of the illogically unbalanced Coriolis.

Players would need to be compensated for the roll-back, with gems equitable to the monies spent and items lost. This rollback would not cost the developer much, but its introduction through strategic notifications might bring back formerly loyal, but currently aggrieved players. Some of these players will likely be willing to resume spending on an app they enjoy.

This is my suggestion. It is not perfect, but it provides a possible solution to save the app and supply an adequate players base for competitive PvP matches.

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I wonder if they should do a rollback or a separate “classic” release like you talked about in another thread. Based off other games,I would say a classic version may do quite well

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I disagree that a rollback would solve the problems. As I see it, the problem with retaining players is because “classic” WoW had a definite conclusion. Character levels maxed out, exploration ended, gear had an absolute cap. Of course people stopped playing, they had beaten the game. Unfortunately the answer they pursued most aggressively was adding more characters. So now you have more characters to level up, but no new content to play with those characters. They eventually raised the level limit and item limit, and even provided a new area to explore. But a week later the new area was explored, and just became another area to grind in challenge mode. Maybe in another year we’ll see another new area to explore for a week.

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My suggestion of a roll back would include resetting player’s heroes to the state that existed two years ago, before they lowered the XP needed for level improvement. No one was close to completing the game at this time, and with the higher XP required for leveling, it seemed unlikely anyone ever would max all heroes. (Note: Foolishly lowering the XP requirements for leveling was another one of the notorious changes that backfired)

Perhaps I am mistaken in assuming you are a newer player @TheChuck. I base this on the recency of your forum account. If you are relatively new you will be unfamiliar with the grand player exoduses. On these occasions, players have resigned en-masse due to a handfull of absolutely abhorred changes. As such, its unfortunate you were not here to enjoy the app when it still had an enormous user base. It is more unfortunate Ludia did not listen to its once vast group of players.

The suggested roll back might provide the developer an opportunity to work with the community rather than against It. D&D flavored features could be added in lieu of the foolishly revamped features they have implemented from their dinosaur games. This melding of misaligned features provided an incohesive experience unfavored by most players. Moreover, instead of wasting resources and energy on junk like Jarlaxle, the raids, event algorithms, and all lots of other unwanted detrius, they could have continued developing additional levels of a great game enjoyed by the masses. Instead of what could have been, we have this bloated corpse.

I admit it may be too late for a roll-back to be successful. However, for survival of the app (and perhaps the developer itself), they must re-learn how to attract users. The thousand (or so) remaining players do not seem to be enough to warrant further development of WoW or any of their other wither apps. I do not see any possibility of salvaging this mess without removing and replacing the most hated of these newer features.

LOL at calling me a newer player. No, I wasn’t playing two years ago. I’ve only been playing for a year and a half, but that’s well over half the time this game has been around. There does seem to be curmudgeonly sense to many of your posts, promoting “The Old Days” as the best of times.
And you still haven’t addressed the issue of running out of content. Rolling back players to a state where they can’t complete the content they have already completed doesn’t equal new content. Players are notoriously unhappy with being forced to repeat old accomplishments. That’s not something that increases the player base, rather it does the opposite. It’s also very unlikely that a rollback is going to reattract people who left the game two years ago. If someone hasn’t played in two years what exactly is going to tell them to download the game again?

Thanks for your feedback TheChuck. I would like to clarify a few points:

As I noted in my post, I was uncertain how long you have played, but I assumed you were a new player since your forum account is only 9 months old. Nonetheless, even if as you have been playing 1.5 years, the game was already in shambles by then. The greatest single drop in players occurred in July 2019, more than 6 months before your arrival.

FYI, I do not know how long WoW has been around, but I know I first downloaded the app in May 2018. Thus, your arrival followed most of the despised changes and was after many of the mass exoduses had occurred. I believe this is why you seem unaware of what the app was originally … you never seen it. It seems likely you have little knowledge of the iterations [those approved by WotC] I am referencing. As such, this may be why you foolishly refer to my “knowledgeable” comments as “curmudgeonly”.

You are correct, but I did reference this above. The developers can provide additional D&D style content after the roll-back. Nobody (or very few non-Ludians) wanted the garbage add-ons we have seen over the past 2 or 3 years. The developer chose to ignore player sentiment and instead rushed out poorly conceived, revamped versions of failed features from other products. These unsurprisingly did not integrate well into WoW. Most post-pubescent users did not clamor for such childish add-ons. The roll back may provide the opportunity to offer features WoW players want.

While there is no way to guarantee any players will return, there are multiple ways Ludia might be able to contact some former users. Email is one option. Direct marketing is another. Notifications is a third possibility. All of these are common and affordable methods. If they could draw back just 10% of the players that left during any if the exoduses, it would multiply the current player base ten-fold. To me, this is worth the risk. It may successfully enable Ludia to take the app off life-support.

Hopefully, this clarifies my perspective. If you were here for some of the earlier iterations I am confident you would agree.

You might wish to check your dates, WoW launch was May 2019. But if you are saying the big exodus was only two months after launch, that doesn’t really point to bad updates, but rather a bad product at launch (or at least a product with a weak hook). Clearly you enjoyed the game in its launch state, but you should realize that most of the people currently playing enjoy it in its current state. In any event, it seems to me that a strategy based on annoying current players and then attempting to re-attract old players should forgo the first step and instead launch a new app to attract old players…

WoW gameplay began long before May 2019. If you click the “activity” tab twice on forum threads screen. Near the top you will see threads for WoW dating back to June 2018, Unless my sense of chronology is deficient, this app existed and underwent many changes long before May 2019.

Your opinion on this matter and unwillingness to accept certain truth seems to be hampered by recency-bias. I suppose it is simpler to deny the past than to learn from it.

For reference of its existence I will link a WoW thread dating from July 2018.
Bug: Injured and Regenerate death - #3 by Salvidrim

I understand that there may be 1000 to 2000 current players and I accept that most like the app the way it is, you among them. However, there are not enough to keep the app alive. As a solution to this dilemma, I am recommending Ludia revert back to an older iteration when the app had 100,000+ active users. This is common sense to anyone who remembers or is willing to accept the quality found in the app’s earlier iterations, many of which occurred before May 2019.

Yes, the forums did exist during the beta before launch. However it’s only been available to the general public since May 2019.
For reference, here’s the thanks for participating in beta post.
To our fans THANK YOU!

Unlike others, I and most of the tens of thousands of former beta users have never worked for either Ludia, Freemantle, Hasbro or WotC. As such, it is evident the app was widely available to myself and multitudes of others long before May 2019. There were significantly more users during the various Beta iterations than there are now.

I suggest it is wise to avoid debating topics while absent requisite knowledge. There is no benefit. Repeatedly doing so might make one appear needlessly foolish.

Hi everyone, just popping in to remind you to please stay on topic of the original post and be respectful of other users :slight_smile:

@Orloch Do you believe that reverting this game to it’s previous state from a year or 2 ago would actually recapture long-lost players, or do you have another agenda? You’re a smart guy, you know there’s an infinitesimally small chance that it would ever work. And there is an actual 0% chance that a company would forfeit and scrap all of it’s software development over the years to gamble like that. They would lose the tens of thousands of dollars in programming costs and development on the game, they’d need to refund likely hundreds of thousands of dollars spanning every single account (including those that haven’t played in years, in the off-chance that they ever did come back. It’d have to be retroactive to the reversion date for everyone).

There would likely need to be additional compensation beyond that, unless they wanted to lose every loyal player that they’ve maintained and who have been grinding away for 2 years, and who pay their bills so to speak. Imagine the financial/billing nightmare of trying to refund tens of thousands of customers from 2-years ago who may no longer have their paypal accounts, same credit cards, same bank accounts, gift cards, etc. These are the things that lawsuits are made of and what bankrupts a company. The sheer staffing costs to try to cover that effort alone would make it a non-starter. I’m going to assume that this isn’t your true agenda or ulterior motive.

I guarantee that Ludia needed to desperately come up with additional “content” because their userbase retention was already experiencing an exodus way before what you believe were undesirable updates. They have all of the data analytics, they needed new features, heroes, and “content” to retain people that were already leaving. Those people were just being offset by newer downloads. For what it’s worth I’ve been playing for over 2 years myself, and only created this forum account around a year or so ago.

Respectfully, I can’t imagine a worse idea than this. If they’re at the point of considering a 2-year “reversion”, then they should already be well beyond the point of just shutting the entire game down. But they won’t, because they still make money on it from the few loyals left, and from the few dozen new players that come every few weeks, throw a few hundreds bucks into the game, and then quit after a few weeks. That’s the current business model and it’s not going to change, because this ship has sailed.

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This is why I stated that a “classic” version would make more sense. At least anecdotally it has been received well on other games. Releasing a separate version from an earlier state in theory is not a big lift/risk, and does not incur issues like refunds.

A few of my own comments to rebut the response provided above.

And there is an actual 0% chance that a company would forfeit and all of it’s software development over the years to gamble like that.

There is no reason not to scrap the last 2 years since many forum posts illustrate how the majority of players believe dropping the “s” from scrap accurately describes the newer content. Besides I suspect the cost of ripping these scripts from their other apps was minimal.

they’d need to refund likely hundreds of thousands of dollars spanning every single account

Untrue. No refunds would be required. They would likely need to provide adequate gems and gold to refund player’s layout over the years. This was outlined in my proposal.

There would likely need to be additional compensation beyond that, unless they wanted to lose every loyal player that they’ve maintained and who have been grinding away for 2 years,

Since expeditious app termination is anticipated, making a last ditch effort to save the app benefits all. It seem users should favor Ludia making this attempt. Otherwise, when the servers go down the users will have nothing to show for the time and money invested.

The sheer staffing costs to try to cover that effort alone would make it a non-starter. I’m going to assume that this isn’t your true agenda or ulterior motive.

You are correct. As you are well aware I do not work for Ludia, so I have no interest in creating work for the staff. However, I understand it is a normal procedure for developers to store previous states of their user accounts. I assume Ludia does this, but I admit I have no idea if they can retrieve as far back as necessary. There may be some cost involved I had not considered.

However, as I have clearly stated many times, my objective is to save a once great app. Nothing more, nothing less.

I guarantee that Ludia needed to desperately come up with additional “content” because their userbase retention was already experiencing an exodus … they needed new features, heroes, and “content” to retain people that were already leaving. Those people were just being offset by newer downloads.

I agree new content was needed. However, a sage team would have heeded player sentiment and added continent suitable to the user base. For some reason this developer has continued to disregard user appetites, and almost all players, new and old, quickly tire of being served spoiled fish.

The few recent downloads in no way comes close to off-setting the lost players. I pity and belief in this statement. It seems unlikely the current user base is even 2% of what it was two years ago.

they still make money on it from the few loyals left, and from the few dozen new players that come every few weeks, throw a few hundreds bucks into the game, and then quit after a few weeks. That’s the current business model and it’s not going to change, because this ship has sailed

This comment gleans of the perceived lack of respect the developer has for its users, partially explaining why things went amiss. However, as we suffer through the 20 minute wait to find a human opponent, it becomes increasing evident many more players are required to support the app.

@Lonesomepixel,

I would have suggested the best choice would be to make a “classic” version, but it seems unlikely WotC would risk the potential of further damage to the brand.

They have already moved onto other developers for future products.

Derailed