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The Balance & Bravery discussion thread

If you missed it, the update notes can be found here: Update 10 - Balance & Bravery

First off, let me say I am very happy with the following listed bug fixes:

Anvil of Dumathoin - The Anvil no longer freezes when attempting to use its poison gas attack.
Durnan’s Card Trades - Durnan now correctly offers to buy cards which have the most extra copies.

These will improve my quality of life overall.

I’m also quite pleased with the challenge economy changes to use d20’s for all the reward dice. This will be quite helpful.

I’m a bit ambivalent about the free challenge defaulting to the hardest dungeon you’ve unlocked.

My current use of the free challenge is to train up my newer characters in sharpstone keep. It lets me basically train them up for free, over time, which is fine while I collect gear to help them level up as well. With the new change, I’ll have to use either uncompleted explore mode to train the character for free (by quitting the dungeon early) or pay to train him by running Sharpstone, which is not something I’m super incentivized to do.

Second, the free challenge defaulting to the hardest dungeon unlocked isn’t something I necessarily want. Right now, I can clear the Hidden Forge without a problem, but I can only beat the Harvestshield Mountain maybe 30-50% of the time. I would rather my free challenge be Hidden Forge than Harvestshield Mountain.

I understand that in terms of programming, it’s easier to default to highest unlock, than create a free challenge token to be consumed by the next challenge to be paid for. But I’m of the opinion that choice is better for the user, and that the token system would not be more difficult to implement.

I have no idea what the new PvP reward system looks like, so I can’t comment on it.

What are your thoughts on the new update?

EDIT: After some math and simulations it looks like it was overall a nerf to the average value of each run, assuming unlocking 3 dice.


The PvP reward system is: 20 victory points instead of 8 to get the chest or coins, and each character defeated is 1 victory point
And characters get XP for a PvP fight (so unlocking lvl 12 renown is not so bad now, because your weakest character can train even in PvP)

I agree that the free challenge being the hardest challenge you have opened up is not as optimal for training your weaker characters, but if the earlier d6 became a d20 now, it is more viable, so I wouldn’t mind to be honest.

I also see a new character, but he is not available yet, he will become available soon. First early access ($$$), then for all.

I like being awarded XP for pvp. However, if I read it correctly, the new brawl chest system could be gamed by deliberately tanking a few matches to build up a better reward for ones you play to win.

If you defeat 3 characters and lose the fights, you still gain 3 victory points (or whatever it is called) progress to the 20 points needed. This way brawling is more rewarding, even if you lose.

They still dont match you up with real players in higher arena levels…

They also seemed to have removed specific character rooms from the challenges and decreased the challenge rewards.

I like the free dungeon being the highest one unlocked, as i will get more xp and better gear faster and easier. The low lvls are not the problem any more, its the long grind between higher lvl ups. You can still lvl up your weaker characters by bringing taunts or cc to keep them alive through as many rooms as possible, getting them potentially more xp than sharpstone

Wanted to add my experience, I just went through the hardest dungeon I unlocked which happens to be Harvestshield Mountain, the red dragon one, I was able to pass phase 1. Got my d20. Couldn’t beat P2 or P3 (final). The XP is increased for this dungeon as are the level of rewards. This is a good update.

I also had my first arena experience. This is a phenomenal update. Gaining XP here is huge. The number of kills for chest points is good as well. Basically made PvP viable. I still had a connection issue trying to fight my opponent. Timed out. Basically I’ve learned when to force close and get back in asap and about 30% I dont miss a turn. Still can affect the outcome of the battle though.

So far these two changes were awesome. And a nice added bonus, got to open three chests upon getting in first time since update and 3x unique legendary items! Thank you devs for this bonus :slight_smile:

Not sure if other things have changed etc.


Yup, im also on harvestshield, can only beat the boss twice, but still rolled a 20 for 10 epic lutes. I am happy. :grin:

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I like the new updates. Though the patch notes stated better rewards for all. Though the rewards for the dungeons have decreased. For a 20 roll you would get 20+ epics for Harvestshield or higher. Now it is half that. I recognize you have 3 times as many chances to get a 20 roll now. But it seems unless you roll the same number multiple times you may get less equipment

You are correct. I did the math for the expect number of epics per cleared run here using Harvestshield Mountain here: The Balance and Bravery Patch decreases the expected epics per run

The my conclusion is that your expected epic return rate for full clear on that challenge has been nerfed around 20%.

And, as I stated in that same thread, gold rewards for challenges have also been nerfed.

Yes, why remove the character specific rooms? I was so close to getting Caliope to level 10 to unlock that room in Hidden Forge. :frowning:

I still have character specific rooms in my runs, so i dont know what you guys are talking aboutScreenshot_20190805-202917

I agree with everything you’ve stated! Well said :metal:

Agree with the Challenge being bad now. It’s like starting over except now I’m getting less XP and have much further to go to level up.

PVP seems okay maybe? At least now you’re not getting punished so hard if you have to fight someone with regenerate.

Honestly, I was hoping for a new campaign since I feel I am a few weeks from finishing this one. Asa result, this is sort of disappointing.

Hmmm, I do have a character room showing up for level 10 Shevarith in Frostsilver, but not the level 10 Caliope in Hidden Forge. So some are still there, and some aren’t.

Love it that it’s all d20s now. I’m aware that it’s harder to hit the epics in a way, but I’m also looking into getting more gold and gems anyway so I’m happy about the new update.

Also, the 20 point brawl rewards is better imo. Gets you the box reward faster without a doubt.

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Thoughts on the timer on the brawl chests?

I’m not going to spend gems, so I’ll be potentially missing out on 12 to 24 hour chests to grab theguaranteed chests.

The next chest rarity is held for you when your slots are full. You will never miss out on the 12-24 hour chests.

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