The De-Mystifying of Ferocity... Hopefully :)

Sionsith · June 8, 2019, 10:04pm

Ferocity is a scale that Ludia has put in place that determines a creatures strength in battle against another creature. The scale is not posted anywhere nor have I been able to find information on how this is calculated. Based on this I have set out on a mission to figure out what the scale is to then hopefully help inform those that look at this post.

Why is Ferocity important?

From what folks on the forum have been able to determine the ferocity of your top 1-3 creatures in your respected group you are fighting in (Jurassic, Cenozoic, or Aquatic groups) determines the strength of the opponents you will face in your daily Player vs Environment (PvE) pack battles. I now believe it is based on your top 3 creatures in each group. So if you get a creature leveled up too high with respect to your other creatures you will create problems for your daily PvE match ups to the point that you will either be unable to complete your daily battles or you will need to spend a large amount of DinoBucks (DB) to speed up the cool down of your high level creature to complete your events.
When you are competing in Player vs Player (PvP) the game uses your teams ferocity to set you against a similar ferocity rated bot profile. (I am hoping to have more information in the future on this which I will add as a separate post)

Now that we know why it is important what does Ferocity look like?

To Start you might ask your self “Why do I care since the game automatically ranks my creatures by ferocity when I am going into a battle screen?”. While this is correct, the game does rank your creatures by their ferocity rank which makes it easy to see from a rank perspective how your current creatures stack up, what the game does not show you is the gap you have from one creature to the next or give you an indication how a new creature might fit into your lineup.
Fore-instance you might have two level 10 Indoraptors as your top creatures in your Jurassic group and are looking to evolve them into a level 20 (this is a common issue now that folks are starting to stack up their Indoraptor Paddock).
- What will this do to my ferocity rankings? And how will this effect my PvE? Since from your game perspective all you are doing is taking your top two creatures and making them one. No big deal right? According to the game display you have the same gap from your second to your third except your second is now your first, the gap is one creature.
Lets say your creature line up is the following: level 10 Indoraptor, level 10 indoraptor, level 40 Indominus Rex, level 20 Indominus Rex, Level 40 Megalosaurus, and a level 40 T-Rex. (this example was from a recent forum post.) What possibly could be the harm in taking my top two creatures and making them a really strong first creature. After all, ever since I hatched my Indoraptors my PvE has gotten significantly harder and having a really strong first creature would help with the battles I have been facing. Remember this example as we will come back to this.

So how is Ferocity Calculated?

From what I can tell Ferocity is calculated by the following equation:
- Ferocity = Health of your creature + 3.2 x the Attack of your creature.
- I have played around with this formula and without getting into differential equations with multiple variable problem solving this is where I landed. This is not a perfect formula as there is something else going on since when I was testing this against my top 60 creatures it worked for the majority but was off occasionally, however when it was off, it was off by fractions of a % so I am not worried about the outliers. This post is intended to help folks make decisions on when to evolve or what to evolve, not figure out to the 2 or 3 decimal on the rank of a creatures ferocity.

Now that we know how to calculate a creatures ferocity lets go back to our example from up above:

Level 10 Indoraptor = 5103 (health) + 3.2 x 2658 (attack) = 13,608.8 Ferocity
Level 10 Indoraptor = 5103 + 3.2 x 2658 = 13,608.8 Ferocity 0% change to get to slot 1
Level 40 Indominus Rex = 5430 + 3.2 x 2074 = 12,066.8 Ferocity 12.8% increase to get to slot 1
Level 20 Indominus Rex = 2517 + 3.2 x 962 = 5,595.4 Ferocity 143.2% increase to get to slot 1
Level 40 Megalosaurus = 2739 + 3.2 x 856 = 5,478.2 Ferocity 148.4% increase to get to slot 1
Level 40 T-Rex = 1603 + 3.2 x 612 = 3,561.4 Ferocity 282.1% increase to get to slot 1

You can see here that the Ferocity of this line up starts to fall very quickly in relation to the top creature, now lets say you decided to evolve those two level 10 Indoraptors to a level 20, well your top creature would now have a Ferocity of = 6764 + 3.2 x 3554 = 18,136.8 resulting in the following:

Level 20 Indoraptor = 18,136.8
Level 40 Indominus Rex = 12,066.8 Ferocity 50.3% increase to get to slot 1
Level 20 Indominus Rex = 5,595.4 Ferocity 224.1% increase to get to slot 1
Level 40 Megalosaurus = 5,478.2 Ferocity 231.1% increase to get to slot 1
Level 40 T-Rex = 3,561.4 Ferocity 409.3% increase to get to slot 1

Now your PvE opponents are based on a creature that is so far ahead of your other creatures you have made your PvE next to impossible unless you are shelling out 250+ DB per cool down on your level 20 Indoraptor for every PvE battle you have that is an open Jurassic Group battle. You would be better suited bringing up the rest of your Jurassic creatures to more closely match your Indoraptors while continuing to hatch level 10 Indoraptors and since PvE seems to be based on your top three strongest creatures once you start replicating a creature that is in your top three your PvE starts to get more and more manageable with every creature you hatch or evolve that gets closer to your top three creatures.

I graphed a section of my creatures and labeled some of them so you can see the gap you can create by evolving your creatures to soon when the rest of your bench is not ready.

For my situation here I got excited about my Indoraptors and evolved 2 lvl 10’s to get a level 20 and since then my PvE has been, challenging (that’s the word I will use). Now it has gotten better since that regretful day, since when I evolved it originally I only had one other lvl 10 Indoraptor and I did not have the Metriaphodons, the level 30 Monostegotop, or the Segnosuchus. As I have added 2 more lvl 10 Indoraptors and those creatures my PvE has become more playable and enjoyable again.

PvE has not gotten harder since I have made those additions which again makes me think PvE is only based on your strongest three creatures. My plan is to bring my Gogosuchuses to lvl 30 which will end up right behind my lvl 10 Indoraptors and potentially my Metriaphodons and Segnosuchuses to level 30 however that will put them between my level 20 and level 10 Indoraptors which will most likely affect my PvE opponents, I will update once I cross that threshold and can test if my PvE gets harder when I change my top three line up.

Adding link to the thread that discusses how this plays into your PvE match making Why is PvE Sooo Hard, or is it?
If you made it this far down in this post thank you for reading and if you found this helpful please leave a like.

Updated

June 8th, 2019: Added information that clarifies that PvE is currently believed to be based on your top three creatures.

Tommi · April 11, 2019, 6:35am

This is so unbelievable good that I would give you 10 likes for this if I could.

HanSoloWannaBe · April 11, 2019, 8:42am

Word. Stuff like this Ludia (and all games) should make publicly available for players to make the best choices in their gameplay. We shouldn’t have to get @Sionsith and others to figure it out. I’m grateful he has!

DinoStan · April 11, 2019, 3:40pm

I had toyed with the idea of selling off my Indo 20 just to bring the difficulty down.
But infinity mode aside (not worth the while with the whimsy rewards anyway), my battles too have gotten much more manageable (relatively speaking versus a month or two back) since acquiring a few more stronger dinos.
Ludia should pay the Sith if they aren’t already.
Seriously.

NatoPMT · April 11, 2019, 4:00pm

Thank you!!

These 2 creatures at these levels are exactly what I have been eyeing up hoping it won’t increase PvE difficulty

When you have Gorgosuchus up to level 30, can you tag me to let me know if they are still behind level 10 indoraptor please? Soz for making you go first!! Im such a scaredy cat

Sionsith · April 11, 2019, 4:34pm

I am fully confident that the level 30 Gorgosuchus will be below the level 10 Indoraptor. I tested my math with leveling Dino’s and watching them change places within the scale of my rankings and was able to verify and predict when a creature would surpass the next creature on my scale. The lvl 30 Gorgosuchus will end up with a Ferocity score of 11,867.8 compared with the level 10 Indoraptor which has a 13,608.6 score. It will be well below. The cool down of the Gorgosuchus will be much higher than the Indoraptor though unfortunately.

NatoPMT · April 11, 2019, 4:51pm

The high health of gorgosuchus had me a bit jittery about levelling up to 30, so that’s good to know! My best current amphibian is ostaposaurus at 40 with ridiculous CD, then Koolasaurus at 40, so adding a couple of level 30 gorgo will just take the CD pressure off and give me more options

Then its my lack of this level herbs I need to tackle.

DinoStan · April 11, 2019, 5:19pm

Nato, go get yourself some monostegotops. They’re more than decent, even at 10. I got two each at 20 and 10. Of course, if you can, the eolambia and unayrhynchus are stronger at 40, but they also take longer to recover.

NatoPMT · April 11, 2019, 5:57pm

Ive got one at level 20 but I haven’t got any S-DNA for monostego in weeks, theres no option to get any more, how are you doing it?

NatoPMT · April 11, 2019, 5:59pm

Ive just started working towards a 2nd level 40 una, got a level 40 and a level 20 but its hard going especially alongside trying to get more gorgos which is eating up my DNA

DinoStan · April 11, 2019, 6:18pm

I just complete as many tasks as I can. Code 19, I actually skip on superhybrids and most VIPs. And I most certainly ain’t dishing out real money for any of those S-DNA packs. So, I’m not doing anything special or unusual.

HanSoloWannaBe · April 11, 2019, 11:57pm

As far as I know, the only ways to get Monolophosaurus S-DNA right now are:

Buy it in a pack;
Win it in the weekly Fight for Fusion event (Tuesdays, I think); or
Win it in Code 19s

It is not currently available in daily missions.

OstaposaurusBae · April 12, 2019, 2:41am

I don’t know if the 3.2 x Attack is correct,

According to this site that I found, it’s Health + (3 x Attack)

This seems to add up for me, because it puts my lvl 30 Indominous in 1st, and then my level 20 Monostegotops, and then my twin lvl 30 Ostaposauruses.

The math adds up imo:

lvl 30 Indominous:

3837 Health
1466 Attack

3837 + (3 x 1466) = 8235 Ferocity

lvl 20 Monostegotops:

4085 Health
1277 Attack

4085 + (3 x 1277) = 7915 Ferocity

lvl 30 Ostaposaurus:

3639 Health
1390 Attack

3639 + (3 x 1390) = 7809 Ferocity

So is the 3.2 from your own experience, or did you read it some other site?

If its from your own experience, can you explain a scenario where the 3.2x value works and not the 3x value? I’m just curious since the 3x value worked for me when I was calculating my lvl 20 Monostegotops evolution to make sure its ferocity didn’t surpass my lvl 30 Indominous (which would cause me to face higher lvl opponents albeit only slightly higher).

Sionsith · April 12, 2019, 3:24am

@OstaposaurusBae yes the 3.2 is correct or at least more correct than the 3 (see my first post up above for comparison. Below I have graphed what the ferocity would be if you use 3 instead of 3.2, pay attention to where the red boxes are:

Notice that within the red boxes there are creatures now on the right side of those boxes that are higher in ferocity than the creatures to the left of them. This means that if the 3 factor was correct they would be ranked higher in ferocity on my list in my feed but they are not they are where they are and the 3.2 is better aligned with the actual ranking within my feed.

Below is the same graph but using the 3.2 factor

I tested this by hatching and leveling creatures one level at a time and watching them increase over other creatures based on the 3.2 factor. Even the 3.2 is off by fraction on some creatures for instance this table has a list of some of my creatures and their rank in my feed:

Rank	Health	Attack
49	2553	590
48	2220	694
47	1887	798
46	1776	833
45	1554	902
44	1221	1006
43	1110	1041

All of their Feroctiy scores are between 4440.2 and 4441.6 but if you calculate their ferocity rank it would not be in the same order as the rank that the game ranks them. Notice it does not go in order as the game ranks them when you compare the level of their ferocity.

Rank	Health	Attack	Ferocity A
49	2553	590	4441.0000
48	2220	694	4440.8000
47	1887	798	4440.6000
46	1776	833	4441.6000
45	1554	902	4440.4000
44	1221	1006	4440.2000
43	1110	1041	4441.2000

I have noticed this seems to only happen with VIP creatures of the same level where their ferocity is almost identical across creatures of the same era at the same level. This is why in my first post I say it works for most creatures but on the fringes their are some at very low % differences are off even with the 3.2 I tried going multiple decimals into the factor but got negligible better results and who wants to remember or use a number like 3.2019468… when it does not really matter when looking at the grand scheme of things.

Kiarash_Bahar · April 13, 2019, 8:06am

Now this, is why i love the forums. Awesome info.
But just how much of a drop in ferocity is OK for PvE? (If i missed the answer i do apologise)
Like, can i evolve my Rajastega to 20 when my current best creature is a lvl 10 Diplosuchus?

Sionsith · April 13, 2019, 3:39pm

this is what their ferocity looks like:

Health	Attack	Ferocity
2,339	608	4,284.60
1,702	716	3,993.20

I don’t think you will see a huge increase in difficulty in your PvE, it will go up slightly but I would’nt think it would be substantial. There is only a 7% difference between the two.

Kiarash_Bahar · April 13, 2019, 3:51pm

Thanks. I’ll probably do it then. I’m really excited for my first lvl 20 legendary hybrid

Sionsith · April 13, 2019, 4:53pm

@Kiarash_Bahar The real question is what does the line up look like after these two? The goal is to keep your top 9-12 creatures semi close to the ferocity of the top three. Since each day for pack battles you will have 3 battles per event with some days having more within the same group. Depending on cool downs if you only have a strong first three you could be quickly out of contention by the 2 battle.

Kiarash_Bahar · April 13, 2019, 5:12pm

Here’s my current creature lineup

After Apatosaurus, i have Stigymoloch, Eolambia and Pterodactylus at 10, then Carnoraptor and Lythronax at 20, then a lvl 30 legendary army. Then it’s super rares at 40.

Sionsith · April 13, 2019, 5:22pm

If PvE has been doable thus far I don’t think you will get any new issues with evolvoing the Raj. I would not evolve the diplosuchus until you had more creatures you could pair up and evolve right after. Just MHO.