What If RNG ISN'T The Problem?

Here me out…

Read this and let’s talk. :slight_smile: I’ll be the one tied to the stake in the middle of the yard. You’ll be the ones with the torches. :smiley:

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Long read. Good read though. I agree with a lot of it.

We should never ever ever force folks to be matched up with other same level dinos though. Trophy count isnt perfect, but thats not the solution. Then you lose the casual players like my wife who LOVES to collect, and steps into arena maybe once a week for a chance at incubators. She has “high level dinos” but she doesnt use them optimally.

Two of my sons, 6 and 9, are the same way.

We have to be careful not to punish people for advancing their accounts.

If the problem is dropping to get dna, fix dna acquisition. If the problem is bullies, use higest trophy count achieved as an indicator and match accordingly.

But please please please do not match on dino levels.

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Dual ranking would be best. I just have no idea how to attain it.

Chess doesn’t have this problem. Ranking is VERY tight there. So much so, that you and someone from another country could get together for a game and based on your rank we could predict with 80% certainty the outcome.

There just needs to be ranking that isn’t flat trophy count and somehow takes skill into the equation.

Edited to add: It could be as simple as keeping track of the times you beat teams with higher average levels versus teams with lower average levels – instead of just awarding a shifting scale trophy amount to you for beating them the one time.

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I agree with a system broader than trophy count and other ideas. I am not sure how a straight team average would ever work though or even how to modify the current system to make it work. It would be a very tricky thing to do without either encouraging not folks to not level, only reward leveling the dinos with the best win percentages (goodbye over leveled dino X), or just create stagnancy through the a tight mix of the same folks with the same dinos. The only ways I could figure that the game could adjust for this mathematically would overvalue your team when it wins under opponent level thus setting you up for a crushing string of defeats? Or am I thinking wrong.

Every solution around those problems seems to cause more problems. Like if you tried to encourage leveling up through better rewards for team average brackets this place would have a daily “the rich get richer thread” beside the other 7 already running.

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I really like “The Real Issue and a Possible Solution” part.

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What about some sort of skills test? Like they do in schools for placement. Wouldn’t matter on team makeup. Like a daily or weekly placement to see if ppl advance or decline

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With crits involved? I mean how would that work? I’m all ears but it would just be “I caught two bad crits and I’m in dummy tier for the fourth straight week” PLS FIX THIS LUDIA

Good article. Nice and thought out, but I still don’t think that RNG is really the problem. The problem is the match up of trophies in the Arena and that players with higher level dinosaurs can drop down intentionally to crush weaker players. This is why I have said numerous times that the Arena levels need to have a dinosaur level bracket and that only teams made of dinosaurs within that bracket can play that Arena - nothing stops you playing a lower Arena providing you have the appropriate level dinosaurs for it.

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Knowing you need to improve doesn’t mean you will. The current system at least means people can sink to a point they win. Many people just want an incubator and go.

I’m also unconvinced Ludia can correctly access the strength of a team. The current system isn’t reliant on Ludias abilities or lack of them. It’s a natural feedback that can’t be messed up by programming.

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great article @MNBrian
this one is also great and i think it didnt have the effect that it was intended:

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its funny… when i first started reading this, i thought you were going to merge price signals in with rng as being the catalyst of us spending to get better. but you took it down a whole different road lol. good read.

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Your right another thing to go wrong. I really try to take rng out as much as possible. Hardly use evasive/cloak and only rely on stuns if it’s a greater chance. But it does fail often. But I think we only remember the times it fails the most

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I try and eliminate RNG dependency in my team as much as possible. Currently I only have one ability on my team that uses RNG and that is the I.rex’s cloak. However the primary reason I use the cloak is for the increase in damage output, any successful dodges are considered a bonus. Though I will admit to using it as a last ditch effort to secure victory from the jaws of defeat when the situation arises.

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Im marathoning some games now. Im recording dodges for me and my opponent. My only issue with rng in this game comes down to the streaks. I don’t mind 5 percent crits. I dont mind 75 percent stuns not landing.

But last night, i was playing my wifes account (sometimes she hands me her phone and says “i need incubators” lol) and i landed 1 of 7 75 percent chance to stun moves.

Thats annoying.

Regarding the data i will present, it will maybe a few dozen games. Stupid small sample size. BUT if i show what i am already talking about, doesn’t that prove that these scenarios occur more often than they “should”? We all know rng is not actually random, its code to simulate randomness. Maybe it makes sense to adjust their algorithm.

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i tend to use my rng dinos first. id rather finish with a better chance then 50/50.

I think arenas should be based on level. That way the more you level your dinosaurs the higher arena you go. Then each arena has ranks based on trophy’s. You could then Run arena tournaments.

I am level 13, and sometimes I get level 18 players. If they are level 18 they have invested time into levelling dinos and should be competing with people with the same time, experience and Dino levels.

The problem with matching with levels or battling at equal levels is that a lot of mid tier people will match with newer spoofer accounts that have been created between ban waves.

I’d thought about a set level tournament as a good idea a short time ago but all that would take would be fresh accounts creating every unique at a very low cost in comparison to the natural way and flooding the tournament.

Unranked battles as a separate option to ranked battles will always be the best option imo as I feel what people are annoyed about the most is not RNG its losing trophies for some reason.

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I definitely see streaks. Battling same person mainly it could go 3-1 your way in the morning. 1-5 the opposite in the evening. With everything going to the winners way

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Thanks @Idgt902 Glad to see others with the same experience. The 2 i did poorly dodging on I lost. And the two i dodged favorably I won.

I tracked 16 games (Im about to go cross eyed, need a break) and i had a few games of note:

0 of 4 dodges for me
1 of 4 dodges for me
4 of 5 dodges for me
7 of 8 dodges for me

And they happened not consecutively, but in that sequence.

This game seems to “hard correct” rng.

What is the probability of that? And that what I said would happen happened - within only 16 games.

@MNBrian i agree rng is not /the/ problem, but I still say it is /a/ problem.

Especially when you consider the raw power of the creatures that hold it (indom, indo, mono) and the fact its a chance at 100% dmg reduction.

I think its the combination of all that.

Note: Yes we reduce it etc etc etc. But I think nullifying should go away, and instead certain skills or buffs should have a “cant miss” modifier. I admit ive not thought that through a lot, and it IS friday afternoon. So be kind in your replies :stuck_out_tongue:

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I agree there is some flaws. But you kind of have to take the good with the bad. The game is still new and has a long way to go. Im sure over time these issues will work out( ie. Change in dino selections/MS/opponents) The rng gives ppl that are overpowered a chance to win against a stronger team. I think that’s why more ppl just starting out depend on it so much. At the end of the day it all pretty much balances out. When I first started I would go on streaks where I could lose 1k trophies a day. I’m also kind of hard headed and don’t know when to quit lol. Point being that as you progress you will learn other ways to win and won’t have to depend on it as much

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