Ludia Forums

Why all the negativity for Monolometrodon but not Magnapyritor

I see lots of posts about wanting to nerf Monolometrodon but none for Magnapyritor.

Both are virtually the same creatures with only minor differences in (mine) ability and one resistance.

So why does Magna not get the same negativity as Monolometrodon?

Magna is much better, but because Monolometrodon is way easier to make. So it is obtainable for lower arena, which causes lower arena unbalance.

26 Likes
  1. Availability. Magnapyritor is significantly harder to make. So by the time you unlock it, you should have access to more counters for it. Monolometerodon has the same counters, but is usually unlocked well before you get them, making it more oppressive early in arena. You’re more likely to have leveled up your Mono a few times before you even unlock Pyritator. Monolometerodon is also easier to level even in higher arenas, and can be boosted to have stats nearly as strong as Magnas can be.

  2. Durability and stats. One major issue people have with Monolometerodon (myself included) is how hard it is to bring it down. Now both Magna and Mono have the same great resistances, but Monolometerodon has more health. This makes Magna easier to revenge kill (and kill in the first place) than Mono. Magna having a stronger turn 3 than Mono doesn’t matter as much when Mono is more likely to actually survive to turn 3 in the first place. The rest of the stats are practically identical. Magnas 1450 attack is better than Monos 1400, but not by a significant amount since it doesn’t reach the next big damage “threshold” of 1500 damage. There isn’t much difference between the dinos that can be killed by a 2800 damage rampage and a 2900 damage rampage (it’s just six dinos, none of which are really meta relevant, with the most relevant being Poukandactylus), but there IS one between those and ones that can be killed by a 3000 damage rampage (26 dinos, including some relevant ones like Alloraptor). When looking at 1 impact + 1 rampage (the most common damage output for these two), the difference is even less: 5075 for Magna and 4900 for Mono. While getting over 5000 damage sounds important at first, since no dinos actually have 5000 health (the next highest is 5100), it actually isn’t. In fact, the only dino in the entire game that Magna can beat in this way that Mono can’t is Koolabourgiana. Now I didn’t account for stuff like distraction, dodge, armor and shields here (and dodge and shields do matter between these two, because of Magnas nullifying impact), but I kept things simple and just used raw stats. So their attack stats are essentially the same, and that’s not even counting giving Mono a couple attack boosts to catch up. As for speed, pop 2 speed boosts on Monolometerodon and it’s faster. It takes 4 health boosts for Magna to surpass Monos health. So when boosts are accounted for, Mono could actually have the better stat spread of the two, sometimes require less boost investment in certain stats (depending on the build you’re going for).

24 Likes

^
lets also not forget that easily accessible cunnings tend to not have the health or distraction resistance to go toe to toe with monolometrodon. the better counters to monolo are also harder to create and at a disadvantage when in the arena. take phorusaura: no distraction resistance, 3900HP and 1400 damage. back to back rampages are only effective on equal levels. it’ll do 4200 in 2 turns. 1 level lower than monolo? it looses.

something like monominiums also just barely wins on equal grounds. 3 turns instead of 2, but its down to 100ish hp and it’s rampage on cooldown. probably won’t survive long after. and jsut like phorusaura above, as soon as there is a single level difference, (which will happen in the arena.) it looses.

monolo’s effective rate at shutting down counters that are even one level lower than it should be adjusted. i know of only two creature at this time that can take it on lower leveled. Alloraptor and poukaidei, which both require exclusive components and aren’t always accessible when starting to face monolo.

7 Likes

Also mono is one of the easiest legendaries to make and level. Wouldn’t it be crazy if a common was the exact same (or better) than a wooly rhino or sarcorixis and way easier to make and level? That would be crazy and mess up the arena well that’s kind of what mono is

4 Likes

Kinda been covered already, but basically, Metro is a Legendary hybrid. Magna is a Unique superhybrid. Magna should be stronger than Metro, but the reality is that it isn’t actually that much better. Metro does less damage, sure, but it’s also considerably tankier–not only does it have more health, it also has better Rend resist, which is pretty pertinent given the abundance of DC. Magna’s biggest problem in arena is Swap-Ins. Metro has far less issue with that. Also, once you account for the discrepancy in Health, Metro & Magna’s stats when boosted are pretty comparable, meaning you’re basically looking at the difference in a better Crit & T3 but less Rend resist for Magna… but considering how these creatures are typically built, you’re not likely to get a T3 unless you’re revenging, and if you’re revenging, there’s a decent chance that Metro can just Strike on T1 and preserve a good T3.

Metro is just too close to Magna for what it is. It needs more-clearly defined weaknesses, as it claps both Fierce & Resilient and doesn’t do too shabby even against its own counters (Cunning), especially in boosted where it can often put a lot of Cunnings in swap-in range with a single hit. One of the problems that people run into in arena is that it’s very difficult to beat Metro even with a counter unless you’ve invested a lot of levels & boosts into the counter, and unfortunately, the abundance of Resilients make investing in most Cunnings that hard not very worthwhile.

All that said, I don’t think Metro needs a big nerf. I would simply remove its Distraction resistance–neither component has it, and it would let Cunnings walk away with a bit more health against a Metro. Metro would still be very strong, but it would simply be more practical to run Cunning creatures to deal with it.

8 Likes

Because Magnapyritor Is Perfectly Balanced as she should be, Monolometrodon? Well, let’s say that he’s not that Balanced…

1 Like

Many thanks for the full responses. That all makes sense.

I guess I was a little blind as I’ve got a level 30 Mono in my team and while it’s useful in the Gyrosphere Depot, it’s not as effective as Magna.

5 Likes

oh i hate magna that pompous frilly little git and yes its harder to make but mono akak rambo has nowhere near the abilities 5 % vs 20% crit and wea ll know magna crits alot it has more base speed it has more damage… and every one and their doigs has one they are a scourge on society and need to be nerfed :stuck_out_tongue: like they nerfed mono before

Beside great points made by many on here like @Mudkipz, @Qiew, and @PuffyPony which show exactly the main problems of Monolometrodon its self I would also like to point out another problem and its also one that faces other hybrids and their super hybrid counter parts. When ludia buffs say a hybrid like say Monolometrodon, or Dracoceratops, or monomimus it kinda makes them so good that they don’t give a reason to upgrade to their later evolutions cause they are just that good. For example Monolorhino is the “better” upgrade as it tyrant but Monolometrodon is just one tier under at elite high. And if you really look at the stats and kit it really loses a lot.

Stats:

  • Health: 4,200 < 4,500
  • Attack: 1,400 > 1,250
  • Speed: 125 > 116
  • Armor: 0 < 30
  • Crit: 5 = 5

Resistances:

  • Crit Reduction: 50=50
  • DoT: 100 =100
  • Rend: 75 > 50
  • Distraction: 50 = 50
  • Speed decrease: 100 > 50
  • Stun: 100 = 100
  • Swap prevention: 75 < 100
  • Taunt: 0 = 0
  • Vulnerability: 100 = 100

Kit:

  • M1: strike = strike
  • M2: strike = strike
  • M3: impact = impact
  • M4: passive instant effect < rampage

Sure rhino has better team synergy and very powerful swap in but it take ages to get to team lvl and considering that it cost 200 Wrhino Dna a pop and you first need to get it to lvl 20. So if Monolometrodon is as good if not better than its hybrid in some ways so why bother investing if there are easier alternatives to it (aka the rat, monostego, dracocera,). So most will just keep investing in monolo which also in turn means they be too invested into it that they probably won’t even think about even making magna cause they already something just as good if not better

The one thing going for Monolorhino is that it plays a very different role on your team than Monolometerodon, and is itself one of the best swap in dinos in the game. So there’s a benefit to using both, they don’t compete directly for a spot on your team. But you do see people just running Woolly Rhino instead (since it competes more directly for that role), and stuff like people using Allosinosaurus instead of Thor before Thor got buffed.

2 Likes

Basically but again it comes down to making powerful easy to make creatures just as good as very hard to make powerful creatures.

In other words if its easier and just as good why make the harder version? Why make rinex or poukidactyl if spxs is easier to make and better than them. And the tier list reflects this problem in a sense.

2 Likes

I’d also like to add to my point above.

A lv 26 magna can be beaten 80% of the time by a base lv erlidom. That is a 5 lv difference that a counter can be. its RNG related if the magna is any higher, but still ok odds of winning up to a lv 29 magna. an 8 level difference.
if we had that kind of win capability for many more legendary and epic cunnings against monolometrodon, we wouldn’t be complaining as much.

7 Likes

Exactly it just the need or more counters that can more easily handle it with taking to much damage or too much effort to make.

1 Like

Why was this a question in the first place? Magna is getting to be underpowered anyway (and will probably fade away once the last 2 apexes hit the arena)

The first thing is monolonmetrodon is a legendry and Magna is a unique but monolo having all Magna features, instead of that, monolonmetrodon is very very easy to create, although he is legendery he is as par of Magna even greater in health which makes no sense…and one thy buddy,for lower level players there’s no any possible counters for monolo bcz he is having so much resistance…