Wildcard class reassignments

Out of curiosity, what are some creatures that you believe should be labeled as a wild card that aren’t? Or wildcard creatures that should be labeled something else?

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@Mudkipz he will explain everything in the universe and also what is and isn’t wildcards

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This might be a stretch but I believe quetzorion just barely sneaks into wildcard. With the armor piercing and shield removal being in its move set

Quetz does have the shields, armor piercing and sidestep to more less be a wildcard. But Ludia has stayed in patch notes that wildcard creatures are ones that can support a team well. For example suchotator would be a great wildcard because it can soft counter the majority of things. Making a great team player when you receive a bad hand.

Tanycolagreus should be Cunning Fierce

Shush, Tanya is wildcard.

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Oh boy… yeah Ludia is pretty inconsistent in their classifications, particularly with Wildcards. There’s a bunch of dinos that aren’t Wildcards that should be (like Parasaurthops and Hydra Boa), and even more that are Wildcards but probably shouldn’t be (e.g. Dodocevia and Tsintamoth).

My personal definition of a Wildcard is that the dino has to have “sufficient” representation of all three classes. What counts as “sufficient” is where you run into a grey area (for example is one attack with Ferocity enough to count as fierce? Is it enough if you have Ferocity AND an armor piercing or swap prevention move?). I’d be happy to go into how I objectively assign classes based on abilities if you’d like. But even pushing that aside, there are so many cases that just don’t work. Deinotherium and Andrewtherium lack cunning abilities entirely as do Tsintaosaurus and Tsintamoth, and yet all of them are Wildcards.

Ludia just seems to slap on whatever class a dino is intended to be on it, whether or not it actually functions that way in battle. I’m actually using the markers (I know, they actually have a use???) to mark each dino’s class for myself (red = fierce, yellow = cunning, orange = Cunning-Fierce, etc. with no marker = wildcard), since so many classes are just entirely unhelpful.

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I like the idea of Tany as a Wildcard, and if they changed the basic attack to Crafty Strike like Quetz it would actually be one (Armor piercing for fierce, precise for resilient, Damage buff removal for cunning). Ironically, Quetz itself actually is a Cunning-Resilient pretty definitively.

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I think Cunning-Resilient works for Quetz. Yes it has armor piercing, but only on one attack. If that was the bar, every single dino with Swap In Stunning Strike would be at least part fierce. My personal rule is that with the exceptions of deceleration, distraction, shield break, (and maybe shields, dodge and DoT) that a dino needs to have at least two ability effects from a particular class in order to count as that class. Compare Lythronax to Majungasaurus, for example. Both have shields and resilient strike, so both are clearly resilient. Lythronax has only one fierce effect (Armor piercing on the counter), so it remains a pure resilient. Majungasaurus has two fierce effects: Armor Piercing on the counter AND Ferocity, which is enough for it to count as Fierce-Resilient. (Knowing that I just said that Crafty Strike is enough for Tany to be a Wildcard but not Quetz, let me explain. Tany only has two attacks, one of which is nullify which is neutral as I explain below, so only the basic strike determines the class. Currently Definite Strike breaks shields, pierces armor, and removes dodge of which only the shield break is sufficient to define its class by my definition, making tany Fierce - which is weird, so I usually make a personal exception for Tany as a common with limited move potential. With Crafty Strike, none of the effects are enough by themselves to assign Tany to a class, and since there’s one from each class, they would essentially cancel each other out and make Tany a Wildcard, whereas on Quetzorion the armor piercing is heavily outweighed by long Invincibility and Sidestep.)

The nullifying moves do remove Shields, but also dodge, Speedup, Damage Increase, and crit chance increase. It’s good against any class, hence why I personally consider Nullify to be a neutral ability that any dino could have without issue (it just happens that Ludia mostly gives it to cunnings). Other than that, all of it’s other abilities are either cunning or resilient, so Cunning-Resilient is a good fit for Quetzorion.

Thats the thing, the movesets are fine: the class just doesn’t match the moveset. So I guess there is a choice: change the dino, or change the moveset.

For example, Carnotaurus is a Wildcard despite lacking any cunning attributes. Ludia can either reclassify it as a fierce-resilient while keeping the moveset the same, or give it a cunning move (maybe bring back Distracting Shields???) to actually make it a Wildcard.

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Here’s my current list of Wildcards that I think should either be reclassified (or have moveset changes):

  • Andrewtherium → Fierce-Resilient
  • Andrewtops → Cunning-Fierce (yes Vulnerability is the main resilient debuff now, and does absolutely mainly fall under the resilient class, but I still don’t think it’s enough by itself to count as resilient - otherwise both Purussauruses should now be Fierce-Resilient)
  • Carnotaurus → Fierce-Resilient
  • Deinotherium → Fierce-Resilient
  • Dodocevia → Cunning
  • Monostegotops → Cunning-Resilient
  • Nasutoceratops → Cunning-Resilient
  • Pterovexus → Cunning-Fierce
  • Tanycolagreus (moveset change, e.g. Definite Strike → Crafty Strike)
  • Tsintamoth → Resilient
  • Tsintaosaurus → Fierce-Resilient

Dinos that currently aren’t Wildcards, but probably should be:

Hydra Boa - speaks for itself

Parasaurthops - literally has “cunning”, “fierce”, and “resilient” moves.

Indotaurus - kind of a sleeper, but it does have access to dodge through it’s Cloak moves to make it cunning, and has Vulnerability and Taunt for resilient (especially if you think that Vulnerability by itself is enough to make a dino Resilient). Should probably at LEAST be Cunning-Fierce.

Diplovenator - a bit of a stretch, but it does clearly have distraction and shield break, as well as two anti-dodge moves to count as a resilient. Take away the precise on the counter though, and it is a Cunning-Fierce.

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Would that mean that Andrewtodon is a Fierce instead of a Heavy?

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I believe it actually would. It wouldn’t even be the fierce with the most armor (Gryposuchus and Keratoporcus each have more, and Allosinosaurus and Purussaurus have just as much). It all stems from whether or not you think one Vulnerability move is enough to count as resilient.

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Also, can ludia PLEASE formally change all of the hybrid class names to daring/heavy/determined? They’re SO much better!

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What’s weird is that they came out on a Beta test back in June, and both Daring and Determined are officially in-game having their own strikes; leaving only Heavy as being the last to be implemented as a Strike or Impact; but at the same it’s taking this long to formally rename the double class creatures.

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Hydra boa should definitely be wild card, It’s more fierce than cunning anyway. Also even though it isn’t a Wildcard Diloracheirus should be Cunning-Resilient.

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Why a Heavy? Because of the GFS or the resistance to Vulnerability?

The only Resilients that use Precise are Titan Gen 2 and her super hybrid; every other Precise related belong to a Cunning or part Cunning in Smilonemys’ case.

Healing is resilient and Ferocity is fierce, simple as that.

Have you forgotten about superiority attacks? Or Devestation? Or Moschops, Titanoboa, Tuojiangosaurus, and Ceramagnus having Precise rampage? Besides, dodge is clearly cunning, so any anti-dodge ability is anti-cunning, and therefore resilient. It just so happens that Precise is fairly common in cunnings as well so dodge doesn’t counter it’s own class too hard. And among most pure cunnings they only have one anti-dodge ability, so it usually checks out.

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So wouldn’t that mean that Mammoth and all her hybrids would technically be Heavy because of their Persistent Ferocious Strike

None of this Precise stuff makes any sense.

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No. Normally I consider that a dino needs Ferocity plus at least one more fierce attack to be considered part fierce. Mammoth (and its hybrids) only have one, so they stay pure resilient. The difference with Tsintaosaurus is that it’s only other non-neutral ability is Heal, which is a minor resilient ability (so needs 2 to be considered resilient), so with one minor fierce and one minor resilient ability Tsintaosaurus is Fierce-Resilient.

How does it not? Dodge is cunning. Precise beats dodge. Dinos that are designed to counter cunning are resilient, therefore Precise is an inherently resilient ability. Gemini and Diplodocus break shields, but that doesn’t mean shield break is a resilient ability. Any superiority attack, devestation, or shielded decelerating strike are all resilient and all of these attacks are Precise. Plus Precise rampage is used by several resilients. Overall, 50 instances of Precise attacks are on resilients, and only 26 are on cunnings (some of which I don’t agree with, like Spionyx and Hydra Boa). And you still think Precise is cunning?